Page 1 of 12 1234511 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 289

Thread: Running the XJ-A140 With Missing Diodes

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    UCSB
    Posts
    406

    Default Running the XJ-A140 With Missing Diodes

    I finally got a hold of a new projector, and was able to resume experimentation. Due to the large amounts of pollution in the existing threads, I have created this thread devoted specifically to running these projectors with 1 or more missing diodes, please keep any other discussion in other threads.

    Current Progress:
    I first removed the diode array, unsoldered 3 of the 4 diode banks, and attached wire to each of the 3 banks. Note, there is a small surface mount component on each of the outer banks, this is a 10k NTC thermistor and removing it will cause an overheat error on the projector. It is important to leave at least one of them in good contact with the diode array, so the the computer can detect possible overheat conditions.
    CIMG2557.JPG

    After this was done, the connections were insulated, and the array installed back in the projector. Space is tight, so don't use excessive tape, and keep in mind that the heatsink gets HOT which will cause most adhesives will loose their stick, so plan accordingly.
    CIMG2565.JPG

    Finally the wires were connected to power resistors (its messy/undersized, I used what was laying around), and the projector was powered up.
    CIMG2571.JPG

    Findings:
    *Removing diodes does not adversely affect the uniformity of the output, I removed 18 diodes from my projector, leaving a single string of 6 at one end of the diode array, and the uniformity of the output did not change appreciably. For reference, the diodes are arranged in 4 groups of 6 diodes, in groupings 3 diodes 'tall' and 2 diodes 'long' stacked next to each other to form a 3x8 array of diodes.

    CIMG2570.JPG
    note - don't trust this picture too much, it is testing my camera more than it is the projector. The white balance looks a bit better in this picture than in real life, however the grays actually do look gray in real life, not purple/brown as in the image.

    *Despite the fact that the 445nm diodes are the workhorse of the projector, it is possible to remove large numbers of them without throwing off the color balance. I removed 18 diodes from my projector, and the output is still acceptable (see image below). The output does look a little yellow, but I have seen properly tuned projectors that looked worse (this is due to the fact that the human eye's color response fits a power law, so the 75% decrease in power only looks ~20% dimmer)

    *The projector's power supply actually has a large compliance voltage range, and works with voltages as low as 20V (as opposed to the 30v typically encountered in operation). This means that you can remove 2 diodes per string (that is a total of 8 diodes) without making any changes to the projector, simply remove up to 2 diodes per string and short across the pads.

    *This also means that you can remove an entire string, and replace it with a simple resistor. Resistances as low as 14ohm work, but I recommend a 15ohm resistor in case different projectors have slightly different compliance voltages. This resistor must be capable of dissipating at least 20W of power, I recommend getting at least a 25W resistor to play it safe. Something like the TBH25P15R0JE ($5 a piece) would work well if it were mounted to the heatsink internally. This might require some creativity/modifications, and in any case I hope to eliminate the need for this resistor altogether (see future work) so I am not perusing this too much further.

    *Due to the pulsed nature of the output, you must be careful to keep the inductance of the dummy resistor low. In my testing I had appropriately 10in^2 of loop area, and while the projector did power up I was able to hear the 75Hz buzz on my radio! This can be done by twisting any leads together, and using a low inductance (NOT wirewound, thick film or the likes) resistor.


    Future Work
    *It looks like it will be possible to disable the voltage sensing entirely and just short out unused channels, I hope to investigate this further. If anyone would like to donate a diode driver board I would be happy to try and modify it. I have a simple schematic drawn up if you would like to perform the mod yourself and report back as well, but it will require cutting traces and rerouting signals. Those who get squeamish at taking a razor to their $800 projector need not apply!

    *I am also investigating how to dim the red led, the current plan is to add a simple resistor in parallel which will divert some current through the resistor, and cause the LED to dim. I hope to try this tomorrow, I suspect that a ~0.25ohm 25W resistor will do the job, although it will get hot! Again, it would be nice to trace down the current sense line inside the projector, I hope to investigate this route as well.

    One Request
    I encourage everyone to perform this type of mod on their projector, however I would like to politely ask that you do not offer this as a service commercially.
    If someone would like me to perform the remove 2 diodes from your projector I would be happy to, simply send my your diode array (you pay shipping both ways) and an I will remove up to 8 diodes from your projector, I only ask that you let me keep one of the diodes I remove for my time. Alternatively, I will perform the mod for $40 and you can keep all of your diodes.
    Obviously there is no way for me to enforce this request, but it is a way to help recoup the time I have invested in reverse engineering these projectors. Needless to say, if people do begin ripping off my findings for commercial gain I will stop publishing them.
    Last edited by krazer; 07-25-2010 at 04:22. Reason: fixed pictures

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Melbourne, Australia
    Posts
    676

    Default

    nice work.

    I'll run it by dave, if he's okay with it, we may have a driver board to send you.
    Now proudly stocking and offering the best deals on laser-wave

    www.lasershowparts.com
    http://stores.ebay.com.au/Lasershow-Parts

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Nottingham, UK
    Posts
    1,920

    Default

    Fantastic work Krazer,
    I know some holography folks will be happy!
    I always thought this was possible going down this route, but never had the time to go out and get some beefy resistors to test with.

    Also, I have *buckets* of spare parts of every kind, thermistors, screws, array ribbons, panels etc.. you name it, I've got boxes full of them.
    I also have many projectors I want to get rid of for a modest cost; most have all the parts still in (except the diodes).
    Please PM me should anyone be interested. Massive discount for anyone wanting several units, or you'd be an absolute godsend if someone wanted to buy the LOT!!!


    - There is no such word as "can't" -
    - 60% of the time it works every time -

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    284

    Default

    How did you manage to unplug the array flat cable from it's connector without destroying it?I never got a reliable connection again once I removed it.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Nottingham, UK
    Posts
    1,920

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by decix View Post
    How did you manage to unplug the array flat cable from it's connector without destroying it?I never got a reliable connection again once I removed it.
    Lift the black flap...


    - There is no such word as "can't" -
    - 60% of the time it works every time -

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    964

    Default

    So...from now on be very cautious when buying casio projectors second hand.
    Most of the diodes could be missing !


  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Cleveland, Ohio
    Posts
    2,182

    Default

    Did the current into the remaining diodes change appreciably after you removed the other sets and put in 15 ohm load resistors?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    UCSB
    Posts
    406

    Default

    Thanks everyone for the driver board offers, hopefully Aijii will come through, if not I might look into getting them shipped in from the UK from briggs.

    @decix, as briggs noted, you simply need to lift the little black flap and you can 'easily' slide the connector in/out. Easily is in quotes for a reason, it takes a bit of practice to get them properly lined up, but after you get it aligned in square it will slide in with very little resistance.

    @drlava, I did not measure the current directly yet, but the current in the resistors was the expected 1.44A peak as measured from a projector with the diodes still in it. The driver board has 4 completely independent current sources (separate controller, etc), so changing one channel is not expected to affect any other channel.

    In the mean time, I have been documenting the various boads in the projector, so far I have been storing my findings in a text file which can be found here. All line items with a * on them mean that I have found the datasheet online, if you need it let me know I can try to give you a link. I am working on updating my webpage with this information and some information on the optics and whatnot, so unless you need it immediately I should have them all linked by next week. If anyone wants to try and figure out what all of the top codes surrounded in question marks are for, be my guest I suspect that a lot of them are from rohm, but manufactures really don't have a good system of identifying parts based on top code in place.

    A few comments/interesting facts:
    *The fan controller board has a connector that can be accessed from the outside of the projector by removing a white sticker. Perhaps some kind of debug interface?
    *The fan controller board is just strait forward implementation of the EMC2305 SMBUS (I2C) penta fan controller, which could be easily used outside of the projector under control of a microprocessor. It would also be possible to use a microprocessor to emulate the controller and just return a 'yes all fans working' for projectors that are running without the fans, or to make an interceptor that runs the fans at a lower speed when there are less diodes in the projector.
    *The diode board wasn't so easy, and has a full on 16 bit microprocessor and a CPLD (think watered down FPGA) on it, however I believe that it conforms to a spec outlined in the TI documentation for the DLPC200 DLP system controller.
    *The DLP chip is a DLP5500 0.55" XGA DMD, which is currently available from TI in a dev kit for $2500
    *There is a triple a axis accelerometer on board for the automatic keystone correction. It looks at which way is 'down' and adjusts the keystone correction accordingly. It actually works pretty well!
    *There is both a serial (RS232) and 2x usb interface available through the back of the projector. One of the USB is routed directly to the DDP2431, and I believe that it can be used to control the chip directly (although this may require a custom firmware upload). The other usb appears to be routed to an unpopulated chip, and I suspect the other serial is routed to the microprocessor although I have not confirmed this.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Minneapolis/St. Paul, MN - USA
    Posts
    60

    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by -bart- View Post
    So...from now on be very cautious when buying casio projectors second hand.
    Most of the diodes could be missing !

    This is exactly what I was thinking.
    The general public may never notice it!

    I'd directly contact the seller and get a guarantee.

    What a way to get a new tv setup and some cool
    diodes!

    O.P. nice thread!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Hannover, Germany
    Posts
    100

    Default

    Hahaha, great. Does it save color balance settings permanently even after power off?

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    UCSB
    Posts
    406

    Default

    This projector does not have any color balance settings, all tests so far have been done with the red source at full power.

    I was tempted to try adjusting the color balance from my computer (most modern video cards have support to do this) but honestly it is good enough as it is. it just gives the video a nice warm feel

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Anaheim, CA
    Posts
    384

    Default

    After you guys finish putting them back together.. Anyone have any projectors they might want to sell me? Preferably in the US.

    - instinct

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    34

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by krazer View Post
    This projector does not have any color balance settings, all tests so far have been done with the red source at full power.
    The projectors normally have a colour balance. But AFAIK this is only active in Economy mode ECO1 or ECO2.

    Joachim
    Producer of EasyLase USB

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Seattle, WA USA
    Posts
    14

    Default

    Curious if anybody has experimented with alternate blue light sources? I've seen 20W and larger multichip blue power LEDs which electrically speaking ought to be a drop in replacement for each string of laser diodes. Obviously the optical performance would be inferior but if the projector is usable with only 6 LDs installed perhaps this would work ok? I bought an A140 to strip the lasers from and had intended to take the whole thing apart for the other bits & pieces but I'm thinking of using it as a testbed for other experiments instead.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Kansas City
    Posts
    176

    Default THANKS

    Thanks so much for the information on this. It worked great. I took out 8 diodes as I really only needed 6 and got back together and it looks just about the same as before. I had really waiting to tear this apart because I hated to have a useless projector for only needing so few diodes.
    Thanks again for all of your hard work.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    UCSB
    Posts
    406

    Default

    Glad to hear that you were successful!

    I am sorry to those who have contacted me on/off the board, school has taken up way more time that I had hoped.

    I will get it figured out eventually...

  17. #17
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    nerdtown, USA
    Posts
    1,126

    Default

    It seems like it would be probable that the red LED drive waveform is derived from an SMbus (actually i2c) controlled chip. In which case, dimming the red LED would be doable by using a microcontroller (say, a tinyAVR or PIC) to inject new signals. Since i2c is an open collector bus, this is safe and easy.

    What chips are in the LED drive section?

  18. #18
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    UCSB
    Posts
    406

    Default

    The waveform is controlled over a serial connection (call it what you want, I2C, smbus, etc they are all the same thing), and yes it should be possible to intercept this signal to adjust the LED brightness. The tricky part is that there is a fair amount of logic on the driver board, and without access to the firmware in the microprocessor or clpd it will take a lot of time with the logic analyzer to trick the projector into doing anything useful. There is one hope however, if you look carefully in the TI DLP documentation, the DLPC200 (this is not the exact chip used in the xj series, but it is the closest I could find) there is a documented LED serial interface, which is used to control your LED driver. if this is actually in use, its documentation could prove invaluable.

    The fan controller board is a little easier, it is also controlled over serial by well documented fan controller chip, so one could probably hack together a microprocessor to turn the fans down without heroic efforts.

    I have documented most of the chips in the projector in a text file linked my previous posts, linked for clarity again here The items with a star next to the part number I have located datasheets for, so if you can't find it pm me and I will see what I can do.

    I also have uploaded an x-ray of the driver board and motherboard in the '445nm Diode Info' thread (post 100) mirrored here

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    2,914

    Default

    I wonder if you could just put 6 diodes or LED's in series to emulate a string of laser diodes?

    would be cool to remove 18 diodes from a projector and still have a usable projector

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    2,914

    Default

    just curious to hear if you ever make any progress on getting it to fire up without using resistors to reduce the power consumption?

  21. #21
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    UCSB
    Posts
    406

    Default

    I have made some progress, although the last 2 quarters in school were killer for me. I am on break now, so I hope to finally get cracking on the projector reverse engineering once again

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Brazil
    Posts
    204

    Default

    Keep us informed man!!

    Quote Originally Posted by krazer View Post
    I have made some progress, although the last 2 quarters in school were killer for me. I am on break now, so I hope to finally get cracking on the projector reverse engineering once again

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Washington DC
    Posts
    49

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by krazer View Post
    I have made some progress, although the last 2 quarters in school were killer for me. I am on break now, so I hope to finally get cracking on the projector reverse engineering once again

    I want to run as red-only but also no-lamp so I can misuse the light gate for holography.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Moscow, Russia
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DanBarlow View Post

    I want to run as red-only but also no-lamp so I can misuse the light gate for holography.
    I found the way to run projector without any lamp(s).
    First, you need to disconnect CN905 flexible wire (mainboard <-> LD driver). After you should to isolate contact pads 2,3,9,10 of flex wire.
    Connect this wire to CN905, short pads 4 and 9 on mainboard.
    That`s all you need. Now you can turn projector on without any lamps.
    I tested this method a few times and received successful results.
    a140_nolamp.jpg
    Last edited by XDev; 07-11-2011 at 13:49.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    St. Louis
    Posts
    207

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •