I almost feel bad posting this.

[goninanbl00d]

Are they selling 1 watt CW lasers, or pulsed lasers that output an invisible beam that can reach a killowatt of peak power during the pulse?

That's the difference. This isn't anything like selling someone a 1 watt 445 laser. This thing is pulsed, and the beam is invisible. The human eye has no pain or aversion response to IR. So if you get nailed with a stray reflection from this thing (or even from a particularly strong specular reflection), you WON'T FEEL IT. And in all likelihood, you won't notice the blind spot either, because your brain will map around it fairly quickly.

No, it will take several hits before you suddenly realize that a large portion of your visual field is missing. But by then it's too late.

This is why people are jumping all over the guy. Not because he's selling a class IV laser, but because he's selling one of the most dangerous types of class IV lasers (plused IR) while clearly demonstrating that he doesn't have the knowledge needed to protect himself or the buyer. (He can't even calculate the peak pulse power correctly.)

As far as his "craftsmanship" skills are concerned, it appears that he bought a plastic toy gun and gutted it. Anyone with a dremel and a free weekend can do that. I'd be more impressed if he was smart enough to realize just how dangerous this project really is. For one, there's no way he should be calling this a "toy"....

Adam

Our points exactly.

The buyer (Arayan) and quite a few 'experienced' veterans (read: post whores) seem to not understand this.

The creator of this monstrosity didn't even understand the concept of pulse power and pulse width.

Most people don't understand the dangers of laser light, let alone this device. And I quote:

"It's only light. It can't hurt"

His latest defence against him doing absolutely nothing about it is "I didn't expect the vid to go viral and for 1000000000 kiddies to see it and want one"

Just because you didn't expect it to go viral doesn't mean you aren't responsible for the video. And if someone does get hurt as a consequence of that video, then you're still to blame.

His ego prevents him taking responsibility for his own actions.

[Arayan]

This is NOT my case, and I'm very sad about the fact that you dare to judge me without knowing me!
A friend of mine have a collection of ancient weapons, but not for this reason he is a violent person, or he authorize to touch or use the objects to those who not have experience.
For me the safety is very important and also for this reason I have included the safety glasses in the picture of my old laser collection (now I have other 4 pair of different safety glasses) also for the "spectators".

if you want the "proof" I have also two pair agains YAG lasers (1064 nm) one from laservision and one from OEM... tomorrow I will post another picture!


I know the intrinsic danger of light, I'm a biologist and an assistant professor in a public University (if you want I can send a curriculum vitae, via PM with enclosed the papers published in international journals with peer-review and impact factor).

now you have to explain to me why this speech does not apply to a person experienced and serious as Mike when he builds his Co2 laser rifle

[lasersbee]

Are they selling 1 watt CW lasers, or pulsed lasers that output an invisible beam that can reach a killowatt of peak power during the pulse?

That's the difference. This isn't anything like selling someone a 1 watt 445 laser. This thing is pulsed, and the beam is invisible. The human eye has no pain or aversion response to IR. So if you get nailed with a stray reflection from this thing (or even from a particularly strong specular reflection), you WON'T FEEL IT. And in all likelihood, you won't notice the blind spot either, because your brain will map around it fairly quickly.

No, it will take several hits before you suddenly realize that a large portion of your visual field is missing. But by then it's too late.

This is why people are jumping all over the guy. Not because he's selling a class IV laser, but because he's selling one of the most dangerous types of class IV lasers (plused IR) while clearly demonstrating that he doesn't have the knowledge needed to protect himself or the buyer. (He can't even calculate the peak pulse power correctly.)

As far as his "craftsmanship" skills are concerned, it appears that he bought a plastic toy gun and gutted it. Anyone with a dremel and a free weekend can do that. I'd be more impressed if he was smart enough to realize just how dangerous this project really is. For one, there's no way he should be calling this a "toy"....

Adam

I understand fully what you are saying Adam.... I was not sticking up
for the guy... He did produce something MORE dangerous than a 1W CW
Laser.

But just because a Laser is 1 Watt CW and visible (445nm) does not make
it safe for the average uninformed "noob" with money in hand to own...

Blind is blind... IMO

BTW... if you can link me to one of those toy guns he used.. I could use one
for my nephew...


Jerry

[goninanbl00d]

This is NOT my case, and I'm very sad about the fact that you dare to judge me without knowing me!
A friend of mine have a collection of ancient weapons, but not for this reason he is a violent person, or he authorize to touch or use the objects to those who not have experience.
For me the safety is very important and also for this reason I have included the safety glasses in the picture of my old laser collection (now I have other 4 pair of different safety glasses) also for the "spectators".

if you want the "proof" I have also two pair agains YAG lasers (1064 nm) one from laservision and one from OEM... tomorrow I will post another picture!


I know the intrinsic danger of light, I'm a biologist and an assistant professor in a public University (if you want I can send a curriculum vitae, via PM with enclosed the papers published in international journals with peer-review and impact factor).

now you have to explain to me why this speech does not apply to a person experienced and serious as Mike when he builds his Co2 laser rifle

Goggles do not prevent stupidity.

Goggles do not remedy sheer experience.

Goggles will not prevent a beam being reflected out of a room and into someone else's eyes.

Goggles will not prevent property damage.

Goggles will not absorb a direct hit. Go on, do the math.

It will take a LOT more than just goggles.

And as for Hemlock_Mike's CO2 rifle-

-Did he market it as a toy?
-Does he know what he's doing?
-Does he not understand the meaning of 20W CW?
-Does he show utter disrespect at those who point out the safety issues that may occur with it?
-Is it in an attractive toy-like host?
-Is it being sold to the public?
-Does it have safety interlocks?
-Is he refusing to take responsibility for his work in the case it did go viral?

Your point is invalid.

And you wonder why everyone here holds LPF with such a degree of contempt.

[Arayan]

Goggles do not prevent stupidity.

Goggles do not remedy sheer experience.

Goggles will not prevent a beam being reflected out of a room and into someone else's eyes.

Goggles will not prevent property damage.

Goggles will not absorb a direct hit. Go on, do the math.

It will take a LOT more than just goggles.

I understand, since I have bought this "laser-gun" I can't realize that goggles do not absorb a direct hit in my eyes, or that this device produce a huge amount of invisible energy that can hurt other people inside or outside the room... I can't understand, I'm ad idiot and only you and few other guys here have the experience, the know-how and the common sense to using high powered laser devices... compliments!

-Did he market it as a toy?
-Does he know what he's doing?
-Does he not understand the meaning of 20W CW?
-Does he show utter disrespect at those who point out the safety issues that may occur with it?
-Is it in an attractive toy-like host?
-Is it being sold to the public?
-Does it have safety interlocks?
-Is he refusing to take responsibility for his work in the case it did go viral?

Your point is invalid.

first of all I commissioned and bought this device BEFORE the video and I know that it is a class IV laser and it's not a TOY!!
The point is that also a scrupolous person as Mike can build or use an high powered laser in a shape of gun or rifle only for pure hobby...

I don't think to post again in this forum, thanks to the community for this kind welcome to a potentially new user...

[goninanbl00d]

I understand, since I have bought this "laser-gun" I can't realize that goggles do not absorb a direct hit in my eyes, or that this device produce a huge amount of invisible energy that can hurt other people inside or outside the room... I can't understand, I'm ad idiot and only you and few other guys here have the experience, the know-how and the common sense to using high powered laser devices... compliments!

first of all I commissioned and bought this device BEFORE the video and I know that it is a class IV laser and it's not a TOY!!
The point is that also a scrupolous person as Mike can build or use an high powered laser in a shape of gun or rifle only for pure hobby...

I don't think to post again in this forum, thanks to the community for this kind welcome to a potentially new user...

AnselmoFanZero did the wrong thing. And you're defending him?

It's not a kind welcome if you're going to defend someone who clearly is doing the wrong thing.

Did I say you were an idiot? No.

The point was: goggles don't mean everything.

The other point was: It was a similar build, but in completely different circumstances. That's a concept you don't seem to have grasped.

[Arayan]

I admit that the video is not clear on how dangerous an object like this can be and AFZ said that the safety factor in the description will be stressed. I'm the first one that I would not want that an object like this fall into the hands of a kid with money, but AFZ has not built to sell to anyone but did this for me. I assure you that we talked almost every day for months and months, even on security factor, and AFZ is not as irresponsible as it may seem.
I'm not defending anyone, but you can not judge (and offend) anyone just for having seen a video.

Did I say you were an idiot? No.

I have concluded it from this sentence:

Goggles do not prevent stupidity

The other point was: It was a similar build, but in completely different circumstances. That's a concept you don't seem to have grasped.

It's not so different, I'm not able to build a device like this and I have commissioned to a person able to build one, but I can use it properly as Mike. I know how to drive a car without being able to build one.

[White-Light]

I admit that the video is not clear on how dangerous an object like this can be and AFZ said that the safety factor in the description will be stressed. I'm the first one that I would not want that an object like this fall into the hands of a kid with money, but AFZ has not built to sell to anyone but did this for me.

You're not repsonsible for his actions so no disrepesct when I say this but that doesn't appear to be true:

LPF Forums http://laserpointerforums.com/f44/1-...-61385-3.html:

Post # 65

Whats PP again??

Its your gun man! ^^ Everybody wants to know who bought this thing. People are WILLING to spend more than 1000$ on this. Holy sh*t.

Post # 69:

Depends...I can make more...but you got THIS particular gun. Known from Netherlands to Brasil my friend. I got mail from France, Denmark, US, Portugal, England, Poland, Canada...

And: I wont copy this gun! This is your design...
I will make a smaller looks-alot-like-it design...but never again this particular design ;-)

Post # 75

Will make some more...
Price will be high. Mail me ;-) neighborino.

Post # 81:

Its just too much work. Not acting selfish, but its MY time...I have SEVERAL projects up my sleeve...already started and on hold, because I cant say no to nice fellas like Arayan.

Cant spend hours to make ANOTHER video. Hope you understand.
I will try making more pics and kinda show how its done and what components I need, during fabrication of the next for-sale-gun.
Just noticed, Gizmondo is telling people to make offers... xD thanks GIZ!

Doesn't sound like someone not intending to sell more.

Kudos to you if you intend to be a responsible owner Arayan. However, just be aware of the dangers even with goggles.

[Arayan]

I can only speak about this device and on the use that I intend to do, obviously I can not speak for others.
What I mean is that even before the construction of it, I spoke with AFZ for a long time and he has informed about me, on my knowledge on lasers, safety, etc.. He not only took the money and nothing else.

[dsli_jon]

http://theweek.com/article/index/213...made-laser-gun

..you go, girl...