TraceIt Question

[tsteele93]

Al,

I think that I've been misunderstanding you a little. I'm crossing up quick trace and animation/frame editor.

If I am understanding correctly you do most of your work in getting the file imported into QS with quick trace, but I'm thinking you DON'T use the animation / frame editor much. So your plan is get it right before importing it.

I don't know if I am hurting myself working on a smallish laptop, but when I try quick trace I have a hard time getting it really right on the input, so I am trying to do some touch up after I pull it in.

Is that a correct understanding?

Because I can't understand how anyone would find the animation / frame editor to be user friendly or intuitive.

Trace-It has problems, but it is a significantly better interface. Of course it has a major bug in that you only get one shot at your edit because there is no way to save it and come back and continue editing. Which is mind boggling.

Ok, I have a new question, should I ask it here or start a new thread... I want to use two images and create an animation from one frame to the next. I can't figure it out. I tried loading Robin1 (made up name) and then I want to load Robin2 and tell animation editor to go from Robin1 to Robin2 and tell QS how many frames to use to get there and let it make the transition.

Is that the right approach? I can't figure out how to get both frames in the editor and tell QS to go from Robin1 to Robin2...

Thanks for any tips...

[Stuka]

Ok,

Honest question to the Pangolin fans... is this not a problem?

I have opened Grayson3.jpg in Trace-It. I have done a lot of editing but I want to do some more later. It is mostly done, but for some reason when I import it into QS there are some glitches that need fixing.

So I save the file that I am working on... I've tried .ILD and .LPC, my only two choices.

Now I come back after dinner to do some more editing.

I cannot open either of those files with Trace-It. I have NO WAY of continuing to edit the file. I can't share it with you and ask you to edit it. I can do NOTHING except load it into QS and use the frame editor which is horrible compared to Trace-It.

How is this not a problem? Is it just because I'm the only one that seems to want to edit graphics? Or is there some obvious, easy way to do this that I'm overlooking?

Any pointers on how to edit graphic files would be appreciated...

Tom

Most folks using using QuickShow are probably using the built-in editor, which is actually pretty darn powerful if you take the time to learn the way it works.
Use the editor to open up one of the existing animations, and you can see how it handles multiple frames.
Once frames have been imported into the QS cue grid, it's pretty easy to combine them in the editor.

Even though TraceIT is still available as a download, you probably won't get much support for it, even from Pangolin.
I'm pretty sure it's part of the discontinued LAStudio suite:

http://www.pangolin.com/LA_Studio/3D.htm


You might want to check this out as well:
http://www.pangolin.com/QS/downloadm...35/page35.html

[tsteele93]

Stuka,

I re-watched Video number 6 (believe it or not, I had watched it once before!) and picked up one very valuable tip. I hadn't noticed that select object would also do a free-form lasso. That is a big improvement over the square lasso that I was seemingly stuck using before.

I am curious if you have ever used Trace-It? I would love to hear from someone who has tried it (it is a very easy download) and see if you don't feel like it is a vast improvement over the built-in editor with QS.

I appreciate your help, and I'm going to go watch more videos to see if I can figure out how to go from Robin1 to Robin2 in the animation editor. I may be confused there... The video I watched just now looked like animation editor would let me take my rolling stones graphic and create animations that would do nice things like draw it in, but I did not see a way to put the rolling stones graphic in place and then the doors graphic and have it create an animation from one to the other. I'll see if there is a different video for that...

Tom

[White-Light]

Al,

I think that I've been misunderstanding you a little. I'm crossing up quick trace and animation/frame editor.

If I am understanding correctly you do most of your work in getting the file imported into QS with quick trace, but I'm thinking you DON'T use the animation / frame editor much. So your plan is get it right before importing it.

It depends.

Firstly if I google an image, I look for something as simple as possible and as contrasty as possible and this all helps the cause.

From here I usually go straight to tracing.

If the areas I see after the trace are correctable easily then I drag and drop it into the workspace and go straight into the editor.

However, if on tracing I can see problematic areas immediately that may be difficult to correct, then I may go back to the JPEG in Photoshop, alter then re-trace. That's what I did with your radio station logo - I knew double lining would be a PITA to remove so I chose to simplify the image. It's often easier to correct the areas in the jpeg than it is to correct an over complex trace.

As for QS itself, again get to know the tracing facility. It's simple but more powerful than it appears.

Also make the best use of your workspace. The 1st thing I do after importing a JPEG expand the work area to its maximum and the preview window out as well. It's makes a huge difference!:




The green arrow here show how I've expanded the area larger and the lines they start from are the lines you drag.

The yellow arrow indicates the window you can drag and drop your completed trace from (note the "Show it Now" button next to the trace window that lets you project it immediately (your earlier request), the preview window into an empty workspace cell. Once in the workspace, minimise the trace area and open up the image editor by a right click over the cue and now expand that full screen and start working. For lines close together use the magnifying glass to expand the image further to create space between the lines as then the problems of point selection disappear.

Finally the red arrow is where the FB3 info appears including the frame rate info (remember earlier I said you can connect the FB3 and not the laser and by clicking enable output it will tell you the display rate (it also tells you this if you connect the laser but the point is it saves you all the hassle of lasering whilst creating).

The other thing to bear in mind is the 3 differing methods and the adjustment bars for each as tracing really is down to method and adjustment.

[White-Light]

I should have added as well this shows the importance of taking the time to learn QS. If you've been working with a small window you've been handicapping yourself because you've not discovered you could expand it.

There's a lot of stuff hidden in QS that adds a lot of power but needs to be found.

eg.

Did you know if you right click over the beat display you get a drop down menu with popular beat rates pre-set, the ability to apply instant multipliers or dividers? Did you know that as well as tapping the beat you can simply type the beat value straight into the display?

Did you know that the VLJ button isn't a straight off or on button, but has a whole plethora of setting options when right clicked?

Did you know the VLJ buttons in the QuickFX area also have right click menus?

What about the power of Projection zones and Beam Attenuation Mapping and Geometric Correction?

As I've said many times, QS appears superficial, like any programme you have to take the time to explore the menus, the right clicks, the expandable windows to get the most out of it.

If you simply pick it up then decide that maybe it doesn't on the surface do what you want it to do, you'll miss out on a lot.

It's well worth Tom sitting down with QS and spending a couple of hours simply exploring every menu, sub menu, feature etc and trying right clicks over everything etc. Also as boring as it may be, try having a read of the manual. It's like Photoshop what's on the surface only scratches the surface. There's a whole lot more underneath.

[tsteele93]

It depends.

Firstly if I google an image, I look for something as simple as possible and as contrasty as possible and this all helps the cause.

From here I usually go straight to tracing.

If the areas I see after the trace are correctable easily then I drag and drop it into the workspace and go straight into the editor.

However, if on tracing I can see problematic areas immediately that may be difficult to correct, then I may go back to the JPEG in Photoshop, alter then re-trace. That's what I did with your radio station logo - I knew double lining would be a PITA to remove so I chose to simplify the image. It's often easier to correct the areas in the jpeg than it is to correct an over complex trace.

I think that is a very good point. We have different perspectives because you have had time to adapt to the environment you find yourself working in, while I am new to it and I'm still wondering, "Why is it a PITA to removes double trace in the editor," and "I don't think it should be a PITA to remove a double trace in the editor."

Does that make sense.

I realize that you have HAD to find workarounds because that is the editor we are stuck with and it probably isn't going to be improved, but I'm still new enough and naive enough to have hoped that maybe by offering some suggestions for improvement, that someone at Pangolin might be active in these forums looking for ways to make their programs better so it wouldn't be a "PITA" to do something that SHOULD BE simple, like removing a double trace.

Also make the best use of your workspace. The 1st thing I do after importing a JPEG expand the work area to its maximum and the preview window out as well. It's makes a huge difference!:

I will do that, but again I feel like you are suggesting workarounds to try and use the editor as little as possible because it ISN'T as good as it should be, so your solution is to try not to have to use it any more than absolutely necessary.


Ultimately I get what you are saying. You are telling me what you have found that works for you and you don't really understand why I don't want to do it your way because after all, that is the way you do it so you like tht way.

I'm saying for me, that isn't how I would have approached it, I would have preferred to have the editor be powerful and ergonomic and to be able to scan something in and THEN to work on it with the editor.

Obviously, you have chosen your way because it works and my way doesn't work so well BECAUSE the editor isn't very refined. Eventually I will just want to get something traced and I will start spending my time getting it traced in as well as possible, and not trying to edit it after tracing it because that is the way that works. But right now I find it frustrating that it is a PITA to do something that should be simple like removing a double line.

Tom

[White-Light]

But right now I find it frustrating that it is a PITA to do something that should be simple like removing a double line.

Tom

The reason why it can be a PITA is not necessarily because of the editor but because of the blanking paths, something you don't have in a drawing program. With laser you an undo a point only to find it unravels to somewhere on the opposite side of a graphic leaving lines straight across the area you want to be perfect. I believe that's because of the hidden blanking paths. Although UNDO will save you, it can make it a PITA to unravel lines because if you;'re not careful you unravel a whole host of stuff you didn't want to touch. That's not Unique to QS or Pangolin, that's the same with all laser graphics because that's the way lasers work. A graphic isn't simply a drawn image, in a laser its beam that turns on and off and moves around all over the place to trace the graphic. Some of that movement is hidden but embedded in the graphic. Hitting the anchor point to one of those paths then causes you the problems I described above which is why laser editing is an art in itself and something you need to learn if you're going to get further with cue editing.

As I said above, take time out to really learn the programme. Quickshow really is the ideal program for what you want to do - parties and halloween. Getting something more complex just makes usage more complex.

[groovysun]

Can anyone suggest where i can download TraceIT.

[norty303]

Can anyone suggest where i can download TraceIT.

You can't anymore due to abuse/piracy I believe. The idea is that you now use the tracing function in Quickshow/Beyond I believe.

[groovysun]

Thanx Norty, I m using FB3 and quickshow, but i need to convert a gif to Ild, any suggestion to do so...