Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 47

Thread: PHOENIX LIVE or pangolin.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Romania
    Posts
    1,039

    Default PHOENIX LIVE or pangolin.

    I am an owner of 23 Pangolin boards with 19 of them being Network upgraded, that is a lot of money to spend with a company over these years and now we must change because it has become more and more frustrating to see the same old bugs appearing/ crashes and problems that should not exist, Buying a new software from the same company is not the answer. Pangolin should have instead of trying to bring out a new product to compete with Phoenix; should have resolved problems with the existing system. The answer is change and give another supplier a chance which we are now doing with Phoenix.

    PHOENIX LIVE is STABLE and something so far we see you can trust.

    Pangolin which over the years has become VERY Unstable and almost cost me a show on new years EVE due to its sloppy programming. We have also spent time testing PHOENIX instead and I have to say it is ROCK SOLID, Sadly I did not use PHOENIX on that New years eve show and have much LESS Stress, We learn !!

    Better solutions come and go; and to go forward it is required to go along with the flow and sometimes that means to change. Pangolin had its day at the top. Now somebody else is stepping in with a better more stable offering.


    I can no longer RISK our shows using Pangolin products.


    Here is a complete list of Phoenix functions.

    http://www.phoenix-showcontroller.de...atures-pro-en/\
    Last edited by andyf97; 01-03-2013 at 00:36.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    5,700

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by andyf97 View Post
    Pangolin VERY Unstable
    Considering that's appears not to be the majority's experience of Pangolin, Andy, you'll be very lucky if Pangolin don't sue you for making such a sweeping statement.

    I've done thousands of hours playing with Beyond and not had a single crash in over a year. The last 10's of builds I've seen are some of the most stable software I've ever seen.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Romania
    Posts
    1,039

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by White-Light View Post
    I've done thousands of hours playing with Beyond and not had a single crash in over a year.
    Yeah, I know well said; you play.

    I WORK.

    In my work as a professional Laser show operator with 28 years experience in events, I find Pangolin to be the MOST UNSTABLE system that we use in our company today that is a FACT, we and many others are turning to Phoenix for this reason. There is no other reason.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Orlando, FL - USA
    Posts
    1,741

    Default

    Andy,

    I will be happy to discuss any problems that you are having, and work to resolve them, just as we endeavor to do with all clients. But in this case, I can't help but feel that your comments are being made purely out of hard feelings.

    Ever since we terminated your dealership a few years ago, you've had nothing but bad things to say about our products -- even to the point of taking jabs at our LASORB product which you know nothing about. You also wrote to me that you were upset that we sent free software to a laserist who left your employment (someone who had nothing but good things to say about you of course ) who provided very good feedback.

    Andy, the fact of the matter is that if the Pangolin system was as bad as you seem to imply, why didn't you abandon it years ago? Why not just switch platforms immediately, instead of continually complaining in public?

    Andy, I'm sorry that we've offended you and hurt your feelings, but your comments above just seem a bit opportunistic...

    Just as Ronald Reagan trusted the judgement of the American People, I trust the judgement of customers in the marketplace. For our main products, free demo versions are available, just as they are available for Phoenix.

    Prospective customers do not need to take my word that our software is great, or your word that our software has flaws. They can simply download demo versions and judge for themselves. They can also come to any Photon Lexicon meeting and, not only meet a lot of great friends and learn about technology, but see the overwhelming satisfaction that customers have with our products.

    As a final note, Andy, I used to get upset by comments like yours but not any more. In the past two years, Pangolin's business has doubled -- mostly because of the things we've learned in business groups like Rock Your Business. One thing I learned recently is that you need a few "haters" out there

    Best regards,

    William Benner

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Romania
    Posts
    1,039

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pangolin View Post
    Andy,

    I will be happy to discuss any problems that you are having, and work to resolve them, just as we endeavor to do with all clients. But in this case, I can't help but feel that your comments are being made purely out of hard feelings.
    William, I have no bad feelings at all, I am very happy in life, always laughing and have a hell of a lot of fun and friends; the thing is people who are planning to spend money need to know the truth and like you always do in your posts you avoid the real points by filling the pages up with other comments that have nothing to do with the topic in question.

    A serious supplier would have asked what happened on new years eve. ))

    Oh The reason for most of your PL posts are simple for spam.

    http://www.google.co.uk/#hl=en&tbo=d...w=1400&bih=907

  6. #6
    Bradfo69's Avatar
    Bradfo69 is offline Pending BST Forum Purchases: $47,127,283.53
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Wilmington, DE
    Posts
    5,971

    Default

    Andy,

    I would like to know what happened on New Years Eve. Please be specific. Understand I am not related to Pangolin in any way and I own and use several different laser show platforms - Pangolin, Phoenix, Moncha, LSX, etc., I don't do shows with the frequency that you do but, I DO run paid shows. The only glitches I have experienced came as a result of a problem with my Windows install and not with particular software. To come in and make a blanket statement about Pangolin without the back story isn't particularly helpful if your point is to convince people not to use it.

    Specifically... which Pangolin product? What computers/operating system were you running it with? How many projectors? Wireless or hard wired? Please describe the details and, what exactly happened that caused you to start this thread?

    I don't want to be in a position of losing a show or, experience a problem mid-show in front of an audience as a result of the software either so, details would be helpful so I can avoid that possible occurance. What do you mean by "unstable"?

    Thanks!

    (I'm not trying to be antogonistic or start anything. I'm just curious exactly what you experienced. Desktop/laptop. A .net box? Are we talking a QM or FB3? - intro, pro or basic - that sort of thing.)
    Last edited by Bradfo69; 01-06-2013 at 09:58. Reason: Mixed up my Andy's.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    5,700

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by andyf97 View Post
    Yeah, I know well said; you play.

    I WORK.
    Andy I might not do professional shows but I do know how to break software which is my hobby and believe me I've spent many many hours per day 7 days a week hammering Beyond which is more hours than any professional is going to have spare using software, as professionals also have to deal with business and using software is only a small part of that. A few minor bugs apart it has been rock solid in all builds within the last year, despite it still being beta (v2.0). It's easy to know if Beyond crashes because beyond the obvious, its self diagnosing and generates a send to Pangolin file that loads a dialogue box with built in email and attachments the very next time the programme is started. This happens even if a crash is not obvious to the user but has nevertheless occured in the background. I've honestly not seen a single crash in over a year despite some very severe provocation. Even finding minor bugs is becoming difficult now as its so supremely written / debugged.

    As for Showtime, you're using 10 year old software that I believe is only still available because as of yet, not all Pangolin's professional shows have Beyond compatability. When they are, I fully expect Showtime will probably be phased away or at least become a legacy product, sometime after v2.0 is released, which takes Beyond to the next level. Even so there are many big name professionals, way bigger in name than you, for whom Showtime, is the number one choice.

    You also allege many other professionals are quitting Pangolin for other software, but that is something that flies in the face of the evidence that Pangolin report they have doubled their business in the last year, something that no doubt can be verified from their accounts. That alone indicates users are apparently moving to Pangolin, not the other way around.

    If you personally have a problem with Showtime, then it would earn you far more respect if you took the conventional reporting route and requested a solution via their support form, assuming there is genuinely a reproduceable problem, rather than making what appear to be wild general accusations in public such as "Pangolin very unstable" when quite clearly Beyond and most Pangolin products are not.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Romania
    Posts
    1,039

    Default

    Looks like your mum wrote that for you )

    Quote Originally Posted by White-Light View Post
    Andy I might not do professional shows but I do know how to break software which is my hobby and believe me I've spent many many hours per day 7 days a week hammering Beyond which is more hours than any professional is going to have spare using software, as professionals also have to deal with business and using software is only a small part of that. A few minor bugs apart it has been rock solid in all builds within the last year, despite it still being beta (v2.0). It's easy to know if Beyond crashes because beyond the obvious, its self diagnosing and generates a send to Pangolin file that loads a dialogue box with built in email and attachments the very next time the programme is started. This happens even if a crash is not obvious to the user but has nevertheless occured in the background. I've honestly not seen a single crash in over a year despite some very severe provocation. Even finding minor bugs is becoming difficult now as its so supremely written / debugged.

    As for Showtime, you're using 10 year old software that I believe is only still available because as of yet, not all Pangolin's professional shows have Beyond compatability. When they are, I fully expect Showtime will probably be phased away or at least become a legacy product, sometime after v2.0 is released, which takes Beyond to the next level. Even so there are many big name professionals, way bigger in name than you, for whom Showtime, is the number one choice.

    You also allege many other professionals are quitting Pangolin for other software, but that is something that flies in the face of the evidence that Pangolin report they have doubled their business in the last year, something that no doubt can be verified from their accounts. That alone indicates users are apparently moving to Pangolin, not the other way around.

    If you personally have a problem with Showtime, then it would earn you far more respect if you took the conventional reporting route and requested a solution via their support form, assuming there is genuinely a reproduceable problem, rather than making what appear to be wild general accusations in public such as "Pangolin very unstable" when quite clearly Beyond and most Pangolin products are not.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    veenwouden
    Posts
    2,542

    Default

    The fact that its becoming more and more stable in the last year is because pangolin are using the hobbiest community to find the bugs.In return they get a free FB3 or some other product from pangolin. You don,t see other brands like Phoenix or showtacle do this. The benefits for pangolin are below:

    They improve there product with allot lower costs then using Professional engineers to find all the bugs.
    They create a new market because some of the hobbyiest community become professional and so they sell even more.
    Giving away stuff creates a forgiveness vibe when things don,t work so everyone is happy so people stay with pangolin.

    Hobbyist arround here on PL seems to think they are doing it al for us hobbiest but in fact its pure bussiness. Pangolin needs the community to test their software to get it up to standard. Other brands don,t do this on such a large scale. Many people arround here think that the FB3 was created for us hobbiests.Its not, its developed for the dmx market so that every dummy can buy a lasershow projector in china and get quick show with it. Some of them become professional and buy a Kvant or RGB lasersystems and they stay with Pangolin because they are used to the software. That is also why they enter the scanner market to expand their bussiness and sales.

    The expanding of the bussiness is mainly because every chinese offers quickshow with their cheap projector. To manufacture an FB3 is dirt cheap and the software is just a copy from a copy.

    On 1 hand they want to show to the hobbyist community that they are "with " the community and they are just a small company but if you know William brenner a little bit he is just a good and smart bussiness man who know what it takes to let his bussiness grow.

    I must admit that the service is excellent and they are very helpfull but my opinion is that people are to quick in jumping to pangolin because others say so. As soon as a few arround say go with pangolin then people don.t look what else is availble. But maybe this also has to do with the fact that this forum is an American one so the majority is in favour of an american based company instead of an overseas one like showtacle.

    If would ask people to stop kissing Pangolin his ass but the community wouldn,t do that anyway because many people get free stuff. I don.t say that everyone is doing this but i know a few arround here they are doing everything to help pangolin as long as they get some products.When you ask did you test others software like moncha or phoenix they say no i only know pangolin and it works great!!! Not really objective if you ask me.


    Just my 2 cents.....


    Oh i would like to know too what the problem was Andy so if you have some more info that would help others too.....


    Interested in a system or modules? Feel free to contact us directly!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Bromley, Kent, UK
    Posts
    201

    Default

    Andy,

    When you want to get rid of your Pangolin products, don`t throw them away. I will be more than willing to recycle them for you.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •