CYGN-B

[Greg]

Is the CYGN-B recognized as a unique enough piece of physics that a Dryer complete system must contain a non-emulated original CYGN-B circuit?


The 3D6B emulator is not a Dryer complete system. The constraint is eight max ADCs for live signal input.


So, for example, the individual gain pots on the 6b panel were an important part of the instrument. In 3D6B one sets punch in / out points for data modification, declares the joysticks as four individual gains, and then does a take.


It's like playing a live rock show by recording two guitar strings at a time, with editing capabilities. It sucks.


But perhaps it's not philosophically as cut and dried as that. The encoders and the 6B can be viewed as a single system requiring exactly one two person take and another one person live performance for the art proper to exist. So the take + performance idea is already there.


I'm developing toward choreography determined parameters dynamically applied to the joysticks so it's like the system hands you all the right dials to turn at the right times, and you get to keep your hands on the joysticks, and still do the live performance.


Two more good ideas noted:
1) A shorthand for the user interface design philosophy behind the 6B.


2) A "Dryer test" regarding performance. laserist and ronhip are among the very few people who could perform the calibration for the test.


Ron: Yes, thank you! Exactly the photos I was remembering. Do you still have access to the photos and slides you preserved? We'd love to see and discuss any photos of people, places, and or equipment you might care to post.


Steve: That circuit lesson sounded interesting. I love the fascinating insights into the theory and history underlying the development of radar that you always share.


Other notes:
Ramp Z is another 3D mode of Ivan space. Suggestions welcome.

[Greg]

on the definition of the Ivan space:


Multiple simultaneous points on a two dimensional plane can be described using a coordinate system. In Ivan space, the points are not independent of each other. Each point described as a vector or coordinate is transformed by a menu of gains, states and offsets, and by joystick positions.


As the result of the collaboration on this thread, an open live performance laser show development framework based on but not limited to an implementation of the Ivan space in C++ code exists. Ok it's not exactly "open".


In any case, an existing implementation in software should make a definition accessible.


In reply to the exploding message, incendiary comment follows. Please realize I'm mostly saying this for the jokes. No offense to anyone.

I want my content, what ever innovative imagery I might develop, to be able to resolve in a pullback to that stately orb of danubes, and have it look as genuine as possible. It's like ending a concert on a blues E. Back to where it all comes from can be a potent theatrical device.


In past discussion it was analogized joysticks vs. DAW to a pool of kids splashing around vs. synchronized swimming. I think this is a very good analogy. I find synchronized swimming dull, but it's all in the mind. Wiggle those joysticks and cymbals crash. Birds fly. Spaceships do ballet, and tornadoes have <censored>.


To scoff at non centering analog joysticks is to sneer at Cymbaline.

[ronhip]

Greg,

Yes, I have access to the archive since, I guess, I'm the "archivist" having done all the digitization of images, videos and documents. Unfortunately I don't have a way to usefully put all that on-line. I don't own a digital Asset Management (DAM) system or have access to a public version anymore. But I do have all the assets and the associated metadata. I was looking into a DAM called "Daminion" (https://daminion.net/) but it only runs under Windows, and I don't think I want to take on running a Windows based machine (I'd much prefer MacOS or LINUX... Something I know...) Scott is still publishing videos to YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Laserium

About me and laserist being the only ones, there are others still around too. Remember, even though I did that wonderful show for 20 years, I haven't touched it since 1998 (28 years ago!!!), so I may a bit rusty, or completely rusted through!

Ron

[mixedgas]

Ivan space has a bit of nonlinear chaos/ noise if any oscillator is on, and by definition the way an oscillator works, some thermal noise and shot noise. Its quantization is a defined at one end by the roughly the charge of an electron. Its limit at the other end is the response curve of the galvos.

There is a definition of galvo optical resolution not dependent on digitization or ADC/DAC resolution. But who cares, the frequency-angle-ballistic characteristics dominate.

Ivan Space, is * huge, very multidimensional, and very nonlinear. Yet some portions of it are reasonably linear. I'd use the term polydimensional analog system.

It is still a large stack of analog transfer functions. However, it is far less repeatable than the "Digital" space.

I like the term "Ivan Space".


* I removed one word, so I don't sound like a famous troll of these parts.
Steve

[Greg]

Here's photos of a color mapping experiment in which an HSV grid is mapped to cycloids. The desert scene is a scrolling background that resembles a blocky old VIC-20 game. The code that generates the color map has access to the same live and recorded input as the rest of the system so one can set up animations and control them live and record the performance

Ron: Certainly making an entire archive publicly accessible brings cost, logistical problems, and would be a sink for time and effort. If ever so inclined though, you are welcome to post the occasional photo that we here can discuss.

Steve: Thank you for your thoughts. I believe your observation that Ivan Space is "...and very nonlinear. Yet some portions of it are reasonably linear" is what I was trying to get at by referencing a menu of transformations.

[laserist]

I think it would be a mistake to try to define Ivan space as devoid of the music that it interprets. And not just any music. There may be a real connection between Laserium's early success and the best of the progressive rock experiments that were happening at the same time. I see clips today and as often as not turn the sound off - because it's crap. Music & cooreography that Ron once described as if constantly hitting you in the face with a brick - for an hour. There's a difference between rocking the audience back (occasionally) and forcing them to cower in their seats. Ivan said the music always came first, but there's music and then there's Music.

[ronhip]

I think my direct quote was "...like smashing you in the face with a brick for an hour", and I saw many laser shows by other companies (who shall remain nameless) where I left exhausted with my ears ringing. Laserium was all about PACING. Yes, you should have those high energy numbers - they're important - but, give the audience (and the laserist...) a break. For example, our Metallica show included "Blackened", but also included "Nothing Else Matters". I contend one of the reasons "Dark Side of the Moon" was so popular was that it did the same - "Money", but also "Great Gig in the Sky." Pacing, pacing, pacing.

And since Greg asked for occasional archive images:



Ron

I think it would be a mistake to try to define Ivan space as devoid of the music that it interprets. And not just any music. There may be a real connection between Laserium's early success and the best of the progressive rock experiments that were happening at the same time. I see clips today and as often as not turn the sound off - because it's crap. Music & cooreography that Ron once described as if constantly hitting you in the face with a brick - for an hour. There's a difference between rocking the audience back (occasionally) and forcing them to cower in their seats. Ivan said the music always came first, but there's music and then there's Music.