It has begun

[mixedgas]

DEAL EXTREME NO LONGER SHIPPING LASERS >5mW TO THE US!

Steve

[allthatwhichis]

Glad we have folks that can make them for us here... This is the beginning of the end though.

[buffo]

The supplier I had for those 50 mw green pointers (in China) stopped shipping to the US back in August. I think it's a sign of things to come.

Adam

[thesk8nmidget]

deal extreme stopped shipping anything above 5mw about 2 months ago. it sucks but with forums you can get plenty of people to buy for you from another country and ship to you

but yes it is a sign of things to come for sure! same with ebay not selling pointers at all anymore!

[frank_1257]

I have hoarded enough pieces to build several nice lasers to last for the next 10years, so unless they do like with guns in the UK screw them.

I have had recent contact with someone whom I went to school with here in Austin, Texas who claimed to still be working do production stage sets for HIGH END SYSTEMS a renowned stage set manufacturing comany based here. He told me that he has seen all usage of laser projection equipment in concerts and productions stage shows, be replaced by super bright pseudo laser (sweeping)
lights.

It was his belief that due to various international accidents and some large frivilous lawsuits without valid basis claiming injuries and blindings that use of lasers in large commercial shows was waning to negligable usage. He thought it was becoming increasingly difficult to insure these shows.

This was only the purported truths of one person working in large production set industry.

I asked Mr. William Benner about this he said my friend was not correct, I would like to hear others experiences with this.

I firmly believe that there are have been and will continue to be unfounded lawsuits because of known blinding capabilities of lasers, and simple greed.

[platinum]

I intend to record my future shows with a high-res camera and DVR with IR floodlights throughout the venue. I think you gave me this idea Steve. I believe this is a very necessary step we should take when performing for the public.

This way, if someone tries to file a lawsuit, I'd have evidence (hopefully) to the contrary. The only thing I wonder about is disclosure in regards to recording people. It would be a security camera of sorts. . .



-Jonathan

[mixedgas]

naw, there has only been one civil suit recently, and I cant get the details, as it is sealed at the request of both parties. It involved several watts used for static beams and was settled (i've heard rumors, between 250,000 and 700,000). Other then that I dare you to find a court case. (you wont) Only one person was injured, and the suit was more or less to put a consistant known bad apple out of business, it did not occur at a varienced installation,was by a individual known for flaunting the rules and dangerous performances, and you'd be hard pressed to find a incident report for any varienced install ran by a trained operator. Said bad apple could not afford the settlement. It didnt bring back the young persons (rumor has it , a girl) eyesight.

The real reason comes down to cost and government paperwork and the need for skilled personel. High power laser does not just "hook up and go" Lighting designers hate laser in most cases, as we have a range of effects they cant come close to with big clunky stepper motor controlled fixtures. DMX fixtures can be hooked up by untrained roadies and only need programmed once for tour, with small "fixes" per venue. Non followspot Lighting staff for a Madonna sized tour might only be 2-3 people, if that many. The followspot guys come with the venue.

Also lighting designers are into "control", if they cant run it off a console, they dont want it in their venue. Most have little idea what a laser really could do anyways. And I've worked with a few of them. The last one wanted dmx plugged into my rig, but got real upset when he found out that would mean more programming work then just canned cues. The laser was quite a bit more capable then his console was, and would take more setup time and learning then he wanted to invest. So I ran the lasers from back stage with mostly mouseclicks and a sync bar. The Pink Floyd Tribute band wanted laser,The Pink Floyd Audience wanted laser, and they got good laser. The LD had to learn to relinquish control to me, and he hated that part. However on the second and third night, I'd hear in the clearcomm, "Ok after intermission,no more cues from me, laser is at your discretion, have a good show, and the clearcomm would click off".
The band noted I was using a performance console with knobs and invited me on stage for night 2 and night 3, I declined. That was for 3500 people a nite at 35$ a ticket. But they only wanted to pay 3500 for a 3 nite gig plus one setup day 575 miles from home. (two days travel) The guy next year bid 1500, brought in 2 watts of 532 as opposed to my 7 watts of RGB and the band hated him as he only had 35 effects vs my pango. Figgure I paid 1500 to rent the medium frame ions locally and then figure out the costs of gas and hotel and fog juice and renting scaffolding etc Just how many of those do you have to do to make a living? BTW I was a subcontractor, they guy who got the bid couldnt perform and hired me at the last minute.

I later learned the LD's whole budget for the show was 17,000$, including his profit and the costs of fixture rental, his staff of 2 and the roadies at union rates, I think he didnt like seeing 1/5 his budget going for lasers. 6 band members, 2 female vocalists, 3-4 other people on stage and the venue and sponsering radio station took probably 50%, that left how much per performer? Not counting sound guy and his rental, electricians, spot operators, legal costs, advertising, travel, and insurance. And probably 10 things I didnt think of.

also other technologies can do the high power projection now, xenon driven dmds for image projection, LED walls are a lot easier to use, and due to some lawsuits on intellectual property, you'll note they dont have much real image content, but they have a "coolness" factor just like lasers. (mind you I find them boring.)

Since you can keep a dmx fixture for 5 years if you are a leasing company, they can become a attractive tax writeoff and pay for themselves many times over, that makes them a lot more attractive businesswise then a sole use laser.

BTW, did you ever consider that one, high end used to make very small very expensive 5-10 mW laser systems precisely because they didnt want to 1. disturb their lighting fixtures markets, 2. didnt want to bother with variences. Several thousand dollars for a few mW of hene. Although they did offer yellow, orange and green henes besides red.

After 9/11 entertainment touring spending in this country plumeted. It has not came back up.

I hope you never meet up with most promoters and club owners, they are always looking for a way to save a buck. Very few will pay for creative content.

Some laser still sells in the US, but I think you'll find the biz is growing in asia and south america. Laser is mandatory for many clubs and bands in Europe.

Steve

[VJ AIWAZ]

hey steve are these the lasers you speak of i have 2 one green one red although i dont have the controller and one (red) had a broken tube
but its a cool design how the hene emits from both ends

[VJ AIWAZ]

lightwave/highend viper laser

[dream beamz]

I hope you never meet up with most promoters and club owners, they are always looking for a way to save a buck. Very few will pay for creative content.

Amen, that is so true it is not even funny. Beam show for the win.